Helicopter B National Results Summary
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jander14indoor
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Helicopter B National Results Summary
Div B National Tournament overview (times with no bonus, top teams all had full logs)
Top team,Solon MS, OH, 3:56.59.
Second, Clague MS, MI, 3:18.3
Third, Kennedy MS, CA, 2:31.31
Fourth, Slauson MS, MI, 2:26.59
Fifth, Daniel Wright JHS, IL, 2:22.38
Sixth, Orlando Science School, FL, 2:21.62
Beyond that, 9 teams were above 2 minutes
another 25 teams above 1 minute
7 incomplete or no logs
5 teams tiered this year, typically either helicopter did not fit their box or box did not fit gage.
An amazing performance by Solon, almost as amazing by Clague and overall very impressive. Congratulations to everyone!
Jeff Anderson
Livonia, MI
Top team,Solon MS, OH, 3:56.59.
Second, Clague MS, MI, 3:18.3
Third, Kennedy MS, CA, 2:31.31
Fourth, Slauson MS, MI, 2:26.59
Fifth, Daniel Wright JHS, IL, 2:22.38
Sixth, Orlando Science School, FL, 2:21.62
Beyond that, 9 teams were above 2 minutes
another 25 teams above 1 minute
7 incomplete or no logs
5 teams tiered this year, typically either helicopter did not fit their box or box did not fit gage.
An amazing performance by Solon, almost as amazing by Clague and overall very impressive. Congratulations to everyone!
Jeff Anderson
Livonia, MI
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- Unome (May 27th, 2025, 3:15 am) • qgzeng (June 5th, 2025, 8:31 pm)
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jgrischow1
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Re: Helicopter B National Results Summary
Jeff, thanks as always. I was going to comment on the huge range just in the top 6, but then I saw 2023 had over a minute between 1-6. Maybe the first year of a new rotation has more of a range then it's somewhat "solved" by the second year? Still, 3:56 and being over 90 seconds above 3rd place is nuts!
By comparison:
Division B Flight 2024
1. 3:36
2. 3:35
3. 3:34
4. 3:30
5. 3:26
6. 2:53
Division B Flight 2023
1. 4:11
2. 4:05
3. 3:20
4. 3:18
5. 3:16
6: 3:08
By comparison:
Division B Flight 2024
1. 3:36
2. 3:35
3. 3:34
4. 3:30
5. 3:26
6. 2:53
Division B Flight 2023
1. 4:11
2. 4:05
3. 3:20
4. 3:18
5. 3:16
6: 3:08
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- qgzeng (June 5th, 2025, 8:31 pm)
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jander14indoor
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Re: Helicopter B National Results Summary
Yeah, the first, and even the second place teams were way ahead of the pack, more so than any tournament I've supervised in my memory.
Possible reasons:
First, few teams had helicopters at 4.0 g. Not 4.1, not 4.2, but 4.0 g. Since any given helicopter only can carry so much total mass, every 0.1 g of helicopter mass takes away that much rubber/energy/fuel. 0.5 g over is likely 15-25% of your rubber and time. The more common 5 g helicopter, 33 to 50% of your time. A real penalty.
Second, matching rubber to the helicopter. This is really the key to maximizing the time for any given helicopter. These two top teams obviously had it nailed down. That takes work.
Third, maximum diameter. These teams had CAREFULLY built boxes and helicopters that utilized the space to get maximum diameter rotors. Max rotor diameter is an important design parameter. NOTE though. To get there they had VERY carefully and skillfully designed and built measurement boxes. If you are not VERY confident you can build such a box, have the right tools, and lots of time, this is also an easy way to get tiered.
Fourth, design. I didn't notice anything very different about these top helicopters. Visually they were 4 bladed top and two bladed bottom rotors. Had a couple of features that I suspect were more for consistency (not unimportant) that time. I think max rotor diameter was possibly the key feature. Possibly properly dialed in pitch, but not something I can pick up visually.
Finally, practice and a little luck. All the above is useless if you don't deliver at the competition.
And to repeat my most common caution. Box size. This gets teams tiered more often than any other reason. Unless you have the time, skills, materials (the box MUST be stiff if you intend to build close to limits) and tools to build it close the rule limits, just DON'T DO IT! Your time is better first used to build a good helicopter at 4.0 g slightly smaller and test, practice, test, practice until you can fly that helicopter consistently. That will get you up into the 2:30 to 3:00 range. IF you have time left, or someone who you trust to build a measurement box for you, then look to box size.
Hmm, not sure if I've made it clear that you need to be careful with the box size...
My thoughts,
Jeff Anderson
Livonia, MI
Possible reasons:
First, few teams had helicopters at 4.0 g. Not 4.1, not 4.2, but 4.0 g. Since any given helicopter only can carry so much total mass, every 0.1 g of helicopter mass takes away that much rubber/energy/fuel. 0.5 g over is likely 15-25% of your rubber and time. The more common 5 g helicopter, 33 to 50% of your time. A real penalty.
Second, matching rubber to the helicopter. This is really the key to maximizing the time for any given helicopter. These two top teams obviously had it nailed down. That takes work.
Third, maximum diameter. These teams had CAREFULLY built boxes and helicopters that utilized the space to get maximum diameter rotors. Max rotor diameter is an important design parameter. NOTE though. To get there they had VERY carefully and skillfully designed and built measurement boxes. If you are not VERY confident you can build such a box, have the right tools, and lots of time, this is also an easy way to get tiered.
Fourth, design. I didn't notice anything very different about these top helicopters. Visually they were 4 bladed top and two bladed bottom rotors. Had a couple of features that I suspect were more for consistency (not unimportant) that time. I think max rotor diameter was possibly the key feature. Possibly properly dialed in pitch, but not something I can pick up visually.
Finally, practice and a little luck. All the above is useless if you don't deliver at the competition.
And to repeat my most common caution. Box size. This gets teams tiered more often than any other reason. Unless you have the time, skills, materials (the box MUST be stiff if you intend to build close to limits) and tools to build it close the rule limits, just DON'T DO IT! Your time is better first used to build a good helicopter at 4.0 g slightly smaller and test, practice, test, practice until you can fly that helicopter consistently. That will get you up into the 2:30 to 3:00 range. IF you have time left, or someone who you trust to build a measurement box for you, then look to box size.
Hmm, not sure if I've made it clear that you need to be careful with the box size...
My thoughts,
Jeff Anderson
Livonia, MI
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coachchuckaahs
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Re: Helicopter B National Results Summary
All great points, Jeff.
In TN, we had at least two teams that showed up without a box. One had no idea a box was needed, the other thought it should be provided by the ES! Read the rules! Another handful (5 or more) had noncompliant boxes, or a smaller than allowed box and a heli that did not fit. This all at STATE level!
It would seem the box is the simple part! The boxes that were off were off by more than 1cm, so not just squeezing in what they could but not having measured the box against the rules.
SO does like the box. It is not going away IMHO. Read the rules, build the box accordingly.
And while at it (I think Jeff mentioned this earlier), the log will not get you tiered, but its an easy 20% gain! At the State level some teams had no log, some have (very) incomplete logs. Line number, and date, would not be considered flight parameters! IF you have multiple heli's, it is important to list which one was flying, but that is marginal to call a flight parameter. Think "what can I adjust AND/OR track".
Coach Chuck
In TN, we had at least two teams that showed up without a box. One had no idea a box was needed, the other thought it should be provided by the ES! Read the rules! Another handful (5 or more) had noncompliant boxes, or a smaller than allowed box and a heli that did not fit. This all at STATE level!
It would seem the box is the simple part! The boxes that were off were off by more than 1cm, so not just squeezing in what they could but not having measured the box against the rules.
SO does like the box. It is not going away IMHO. Read the rules, build the box accordingly.
And while at it (I think Jeff mentioned this earlier), the log will not get you tiered, but its an easy 20% gain! At the State level some teams had no log, some have (very) incomplete logs. Line number, and date, would not be considered flight parameters! IF you have multiple heli's, it is important to list which one was flying, but that is marginal to call a flight parameter. Think "what can I adjust AND/OR track".
Coach Chuck
Coach, Albuquerque Area Home Schoolers Flying Events
Nationals Results:
2016 C WS 8th place
2018 B WS 2nd place
2018 C Heli Champion
2019 B ELG 3rd place
2019 C WS Champion
AMA Results: 3 AAHS members qualify for US Jr Team in F1D, 4 new youth senior records
Nationals Results:
2016 C WS 8th place
2018 B WS 2nd place
2018 C Heli Champion
2019 B ELG 3rd place
2019 C WS Champion
AMA Results: 3 AAHS members qualify for US Jr Team in F1D, 4 new youth senior records