Machines B/C

[bernard]

[bernard]

[atitthaker]

Hello,

I am coaching for the first time for Machines Div B. If this question is not appropriate for this forum, please let me know if there is different place I should post it.

I have a question about calculators that are used/allowed for this event. Event wiki page suggests that two class 3 calculators are allowed per team. From the materials I have seen so far, I am not sure how kids would need a graphing/programmable calculator for this event. To me it seems, they would need Class 1 or Class 2 calculator mostly.

Can previous year coaches advise how/when kids would need Class 3 calculators? Is it more for Div C or Nationals when they need Class 3 calculator?
Also, on the Calculators wiki page, description says to "...identify non-graphing, programmable calculator..." but the examples given Casio 975 0/9850/9860, HP 40/50/PRIME, TI 83/84/89/NSPIRE/VOYAGE are all graphing calculator.

I am trying to understand what type of calculators to purchase for the team and I am bit confused with available information. If someone can provide information from their past experience/interpretation of the rules, that would be really helpful.

Thanks
Atit

[Nydauron]

Hello,

I am coaching for the first time for Machines Div B. If this question is not appropriate for this forum, please let me know if there is different place I should post it.

I have a question about calculators that are used/allowed for this event. Event wiki page suggests that two class 3 calculators are allowed per team. From the materials I have seen so far, I am not sure how kids would need a graphing/programmable calculator for this event. To me it seems, they would need Class 1 or Class 2 calculator mostly.

Can previous year coaches advise how/when kids would need Class 3 calculators? Is it more for Div C or Nationals when they need Class 3 calculator?
Also, on the Calculators wiki page, description says to "...identify non-graphing, programmable calculator..." but the examples given Casio 975 0/9850/9860, HP 40/50/PRIME, TI 83/84/89/NSPIRE/VOYAGE are all graphing calculator.

I am trying to understand what type of calculators to purchase for the team and I am bit confused with available information. If someone can provide information from their past experience/interpretation of the rules, that would be really helpful.

Thanks
Atit

Welcome! This question is appropriate enough here, but this definitely can pertain to other events outside of Machines.

For anything you are confused about, refer to the Rules Manual, as it is the source of truth. The wiki always gets retroactively updated and is community-driven, so some pages might have either outdated information or ambiguity (as in this case, it is the latter). SOInc defines calculator classes on page B68 of this season's Rules Manual, which states Class III also includes "stand-alone, programmable, graphing calculators" and directly names the Casio 9750/9850/9860, HP 40/50/PRIME, and TI-83/84/89/NSPIRE/VOYAGE as valid calculators. It also includes all lower-class calculators as well.

Another point to be made is that each event that allows calculators has a defined limit on how many can be brought into that event, some limited to the participant, some limited to the team (i.e., the 1-3 people that participate in the event). The term "team" in the event rules usually refers to the participating members for that particular event and not the entire 15-person team.

That being said, getting a programming calculator, graphing or non-graphing, is not entirely necessary. The graphing functionality on these calculators is more of a QoL, and will be used seldom to occasionally during events (for Machines B in particular, rule 5.f says basic algebra, geometry, and trig will be used, all of which don't really need the graphing functionality). While it is not uncommon for students in higher-level math classes to have graphing calculators, like TI-84s, when comparing the Class II to Class III calculators, the only real differentiating factors are that Class III calculators are programmable, meaning users can write programs to perform a set of calculations. Texas Instruments' graphing calculators use a language called TI-BASIC, which is the foundation on which programs can be built. It helps reduce the number of inputs, increasing speed towards a solution, if used correctly. However, if the user isn't going to make use of those features, then you may choose to opt for a scientific calculator instead. Ultimately, the user needs to be familiar with the calculator to perform well with it, hence why having students have their own calculators in math class is a good recommendation.

Some, if not all, of your students probably have their own calculators, most likely a scientific Class II-compliant calculator, for classes like Algebra. I'm not a coach, so I have no recommendation if you should or should not buy any calculators (besides having a reserve of Class I calculators for the events that need them). Again, I am blatantly assuming your situation, but from my experience as a competitor, we had a reserve of class-I and class-II calculators (in case anyone forgot their calculator) on both my Div B and C teams.

[atitthaker]

Thank you very much for your prompt and detailed reply and explaining purpose of getting programmable calculator.

Thank you
Atit

[knightmoves]

Thank you very much for your prompt and detailed reply and explaining purpose of getting programmable calculator.

Thank you
Atit

I agree with everything Nydauron said. I'll add that there's an obvious advantage for team members to use their own personal calculators (they're familiar with where all the functions are, so don't have to hunt for the right button), but a class II calculator is perfectly adequate for Machines at both B and C levels, and the extra graphing, program, and stats features on a class III calculator are unlikely to be of any use for this event. But if the calculator the students own is a class III (a lot of students will own a TI-84, for example), they are not prevented from using it, and using it won't confer an unfair advantage on them.

Students could write, or obtain, programs to compute mechanical advantage and torque, but they're not going to be faster or more accurate that just doing the calculation.