Ornithology B/C

[PacificGoldenPlover]

Does anyone know how to distinguish between the Carolina and Marsh Wren? Seems like I always get those two mixed up...

The tail and wings of a carolina wren has the white "stripes" on a brown tail and wings while the tail and wings of a marsh wren has the white "stripes" on a blackish or dark brown tail and wings.

Carolina Wren


Marsh Wren

Sweet, thank you!

Sorry to be late, but I just to add a couple other field marks: Carolina Wren overall has a very warm chestnut-brick back, while the brown on MAWR is more of a beige.
In addition, CARW has a much longer tail proportionate to its body size than MAWR, along with a longer, slightly decurved bill. This gives it a more "gangly" appearance in my experience. Also, the white supercilium (line above the eye) is much more demarcated on CARW.

[pepperonipi]

The tail and wings of a carolina wren has the white "stripes" on a brown tail and wings while the tail and wings of a marsh wren has the white "stripes" on a blackish or dark brown tail and wings.

Carolina Wren


Marsh Wren

Sweet, thank you!

Sorry to be late, but I just to add a couple other field marks: Carolina Wren overall has a very warm chestnut-brick back, while the brown on MAWR is more of a beige.
In addition, CARW has a much longer tail proportionate to its body size than MAWR, along with a longer, slightly decurved bill. This gives it a more "gangly" appearance in my experience. Also, the white supercilium (line above the eye) is much more demarcated on CARW.

Thanks for the info. I was trying to solely use the line above the eye trick, but it wasn't really working well by itself.

[DanglesBanana]

Does anyone have a sample flowchart for ID? I memorized all of it but I just want to make a flowchart to supplement and I am having trouble with how to make it. Thanks

[Blank25]

For the Clapper Rail on the sheet do they mean Mangrove rail because the scientific name they have is Rallus longirostris which is the mangrove rail so do I do stuff for mangrove rail or clapper rail?

[isotelus]

For the Clapper Rail on the sheet do they mean Mangrove rail because the scientific name they have is Rallus longirostris which is the mangrove rail so do I do stuff for mangrove rail or clapper rail?

Always use the list as the official guide for what and what not to do. Recently, the mangrove rail and Ridgway's rail were split from the clapper rail. I would suggest including information on this split and having information on the clapper rail. Most test writers using clapper rail should be aware of this. However, if you're worried and have some extra space in your binder, just put some information on mangrove and Ridgway's rail in.

[DanglesBanana]

So my state has a state bird list and I have an invitational coming up really soon so I was wondering if invitationals would use the state list or the national list.

[Blank25]

So my state has a state bird list and I have an invitational coming up really soon so I was wondering if invitationals would use the state list or the national list.

The state should specify if the state list is used for invitationals or not. In NY, I know the state list is only for the state competition and not for invitationals and regionals.

[Blank25]

For the Clapper Rail on the sheet do they mean Mangrove rail because the scientific name they have is Rallus longirostris which is the mangrove rail so do I do stuff for mangrove rail or clapper rail?

Always use the list as the official guide for what and what not to do. Recently, the mangrove rail and Ridgway's rail were split from the clapper rail. I would suggest including information on this split and having information on the clapper rail. Most test writers using clapper rail should be aware of this. However, if you're worried and have some extra space in your binder, just put some information on mangrove and Ridgway's rail in.

Ok, thanks.

[jgrischow1]

For the Clapper Rail on the sheet do they mean Mangrove rail because the scientific name they have is Rallus longirostris which is the mangrove rail so do I do stuff for mangrove rail or clapper rail?

Always use the list as the official guide for what and what not to do. Recently, the mangrove rail and Ridgway's rail were split from the clapper rail. I would suggest including information on this split and having information on the clapper rail. Most test writers using clapper rail should be aware of this. However, if you're worried and have some extra space in your binder, just put some information on mangrove and Ridgway's rail in.

Ok, thanks.

So two FAQs were posted on this...

"(Section: List / Line: 40)
10/29/2019
UNDER THE LIST, IT SAYS “CLAPPER RAIL” WITH THE SCIENTIFIC NAME OF RALLUS LONGIROSTRIS. HOWEVER, RALLUS LONGIROSTRIS IS ACTUALLY THE MANGROVE RAIL, WHICH IS NOT IN THE RULES. WHICH ONE SHOULD PARTICIPANTS STUDY?
Use the taxonomy as listed on the Official National Bird List."

and

"(Section: 2 / Paragraph: c / Line: 1)
11/08/2019
THE 2020 NATIONAL BIRD LIST LISTS CLAPPER RAIL'S SCIENTIFIC NAME AS RALLUS LONGIROSTRIS, BUT ONLINE SOURCES SAY THAT RALLUS LONGIROSTRIS IS INSTEAD THE MANGROVE RAIL AND THAT THE CLAPPER RAIL IS RALLUS CREPITANS. IS THIS A TYPO?
The National Bird List taxonomic scheme is based upon the 7th edition Checklist of North American Birds, American Ornithologists’ Union, and www.allaboutbirds.org from 2019 Cornell University Laboratory of Ornithology and reflects the expectations of the event supervisors."

but as our Ornitho coach pointed out, both sources cited by the FAQ answer agree with the original question and contradict the National List rather than corroborate it.

[hmmm]

Always use the list as the official guide for what and what not to do. Recently, the mangrove rail and Ridgway's rail were split from the clapper rail. I would suggest including information on this split and having information on the clapper rail. Most test writers using clapper rail should be aware of this. However, if you're worried and have some extra space in your binder, just put some information on mangrove and Ridgway's rail in.

Ok, thanks.

So two FAQs were posted on this...

"(Section: List / Line: 40)
10/29/2019
UNDER THE LIST, IT SAYS “CLAPPER RAIL” WITH THE SCIENTIFIC NAME OF RALLUS LONGIROSTRIS. HOWEVER, RALLUS LONGIROSTRIS IS ACTUALLY THE MANGROVE RAIL, WHICH IS NOT IN THE RULES. WHICH ONE SHOULD PARTICIPANTS STUDY?
Use the taxonomy as listed on the Official National Bird List."

and

"(Section: 2 / Paragraph: c / Line: 1)
11/08/2019
THE 2020 NATIONAL BIRD LIST LISTS CLAPPER RAIL'S SCIENTIFIC NAME AS RALLUS LONGIROSTRIS, BUT ONLINE SOURCES SAY THAT RALLUS LONGIROSTRIS IS INSTEAD THE MANGROVE RAIL AND THAT THE CLAPPER RAIL IS RALLUS CREPITANS. IS THIS A TYPO?
The National Bird List taxonomic scheme is based upon the 7th edition Checklist of North American Birds, American Ornithologists’ Union, and www.allaboutbirds.org from 2019 Cornell University Laboratory of Ornithology and reflects the expectations of the event supervisors."

but as our Ornitho coach pointed out, both sources cited by the FAQ answer agree with the original question and contradict the National List rather than corroborate it.

Its scioly, every id list always has taxonomy issues. Just go by the list.