Robo-Cross B

[bernard]

The soinc.org site still lists the Robocross spreadsheet download as V2 with an update date of 12/11/14.
Is the link actually to the fixed version? If so, if the file name is the same how will people know if they have the fixed version or a version with a bug?

When they post new files they will update it with a post date. You can also check the last modification date for your downloaded file.

[computers4fun]

Any idea when the fixed version of the spreadsheet will be posted? The error was found last Friday. According to Jeff the spreadsheet has been fixed, but the sonic.org site still shows the Robo-cross spreadsheet download as V2 with an update date of 12/11/14. There is no mention on the sonic.org site that an error was found in the currently posted spreadsheet.

With local and regional competitions going on nearly every weekend, I would think we would want to ensure the most up-to-date scoring tools are available. Certainly we don’t want incorrect scores caused by a known spreadsheet error.

[RR]

Does anyone know if the passive parts of the robot should be fully supported by the robot or not, inside the 28x28x28 before the start of the run? In one of the invitationals we were told that all parts of the robot should be fully supported by the robot. I did ask for clarification of the rules at soinc.org ... Thanks

[jander14indoor]

As usual, this is not official forum, not official answer, contact national, etc...

Are you setting them on the board next to the robot or asking if the measurement box can hold things in?

Relevant paragraphs seem to be:
2.d. The Robot in the ready to run position must fit entirely inside an imaginary 28.0 cm cube
2.e. The Robot may drop passive components, but must not separate into two or more active components.

To me, the first paragraph is clear everything must fit inside the cube without expecting whatever physical device is used to measure it to hold things in. I could imagine an ES using a laser device for example to determine if things are in our out of the cube.
The second paragraph clearly considers any passive components to be part of the robot so they must be in the imaginary box too. Now, supported. 2.e. certainly allows passive components to be dropped, not so clear if you can pick them up. But usually SO operates under the principal, if it isn't forbidden, it is allowed. Of course that is diametrically opposed to the "spirit of the competition" principal that SO also uses.

Now, as an ES, I might not sweat that, but another ES might.
As a coach talking to competitors, seems like that would fall into the category of, what do you gain and is it worth being second tiered? Seems like it would be easy enough to support any passive components on the robot until needed instead of setting them on the ground and avoiding the whole issue.
As a competitor, I wouldn't do it unless there was a VERY large gain to be made.

My 2 cents,
Jeff Anderson
Livonia, MI

[seadog]

Hello all
I understand that the official rules posted on the soinc website about Wireless Remote Control devices indicates the following
"Competitors are allowed to utilize the following types of wireless connections to control their devices:
- Radio waves as allowed by FCC regulations, which correspond to both the frequency (e.g. 2.4 GHz, 5.8 GHz, etc.) and the power (e.g. 100mW, 50mW, etc.).
Allowable examples include, but aren’t limited to: Bluetooth, WiFi, ZigBee, R/Ccars, etc.
- Note that some older R/C systems designed explicitly for model aircraft operate in the 72.0 – 73.0 MHz range and are explicitly prohibited from operating model
‘surface’ vehicles and devices. The corresponding, allowable, surface devices operate in the 75.4 – 76.0 MHz and 27 MHz range. Most modern R/C systems
operate in the 2.4 or 5.8 GHz range and incorporate ‘spread spectrum technology."

So does this mean that ONLY those devices operating in the 72-73MHz range are explicitly prohibited and all others are implicitly allowed?
So far, we're unable to find enough documentation to use as evidence that our controller meets the frequency as well as the power guidelines
Any idea what may be the motivation/thought behind these rules? Perhaps that will enable us to estimate our chances of being tiered.
Thank you!

[chalker]

Hello all
I understand that the official rules posted on the soinc website about Wireless Remote Control devices indicates the following
"Competitors are allowed to utilize the following types of wireless connections to control their devices:
- Radio waves as allowed by FCC regulations, which correspond to both the frequency (e.g. 2.4 GHz, 5.8 GHz, etc.) and the power (e.g. 100mW, 50mW, etc.).
Allowable examples include, but aren’t limited to: Bluetooth, WiFi, ZigBee, R/Ccars, etc.
- Note that some older R/C systems designed explicitly for model aircraft operate in the 72.0 – 73.0 MHz range and are explicitly prohibited from operating model
‘surface’ vehicles and devices. The corresponding, allowable, surface devices operate in the 75.4 – 76.0 MHz and 27 MHz range. Most modern R/C systems
operate in the 2.4 or 5.8 GHz range and incorporate ‘spread spectrum technology."

So does this mean that ONLY those devices operating in the 72-73MHz range are explicitly prohibited and all others are implicitly allowed?
So far, we're unable to find enough documentation to use as evidence that our controller meets the frequency as well as the power guidelines
Any idea what may be the motivation/thought behind these rules? Perhaps that will enable us to estimate our chances of being tiered.
Thank you!

No it doesn't mean all others are implicitly allowed. The motivation is actually due to complying with federal law. The FCC is very strict about what happens with radio waves. In addition, event supervisors want to avoid teams using the same frequency at the same time and accidentally controlling the wrong device. What is the controller that you are using? If you give us some details we might be able to help.

[goodcheer]

Hello everyone,

I was reviewing the rules and it said that we had to have a modification on a robot built from a commercial kit. My team is using the Clawbot kit from Vex and we have the option to switch the motors into high speed mode. If the motors are switched into high speed mode, will that count as a modification?

Thanks in advance for responding.

I would go with a structural modification, like replacing one or some of the metal pieces with plastic or wood shaped to fit. Make it fit the rules that if you removed the modification(s) the robot would not function as intended by the kit. You should probably use whatever motor speed would work best for your design.

[seadog]

No it doesn't mean all others are implicitly allowed. The motivation is actually due to complying with federal law. The FCC is very strict about what happens with radio waves. In addition, event supervisors want to avoid teams using the same frequency at the same time and accidentally controlling the wrong device. What is the controller that you are using? If you give us some details we might be able to help.

Thanks! We are planning to use a Vex joystick with a VexNet 2.0 key. The documentation says it uses a "VEXnet 2.0 communication protocol over a custom 2.4 GHz radio."
It does not include any further explanation on whether it meets any FCC regulations/standards or what power it uses.
I would think we should be OK with respect to interfering with other devices. However wasn't sure about the FCC and other concerns you mentioned.

[retired1]

That is absolutely allowed.
It has an advantage of being a direct link (keyed by code) to the receiver so it is virtually impossible to be interfered with by another transmitter. It is somewhat like your garage door opener with a rolling code.

[seadog]

Great! Thank you for your quick reply.
How are everyone's scores so far? We are just beginning but it looks much harder with the sorting of objects.