Unofficial Rankings B

[dxu46]

does anyone know how Tennessee's state comp went

Cedar Springs won for B, White Station C.

[Unome]

There was only 9 points between us and Barrington, and we only won bc of them bombing buggy.

Anyone remember that one time where the top 5 or so teams in IN C were within 10 points?

I went to check all the results published on the wiki and didn't find any such year

I think it was 2004 or 2006, something in that range. I remember trying to find it on the state tournament website after seeing the scores on the OBB archive but I couldn't find whatever year it was.

[Bread]

Anyone remember that one time where the top 5 or so teams in IN C were within 10 points?

I went to check all the results published on the wiki and didn't find any such year

I think it was 2004 or 2006, something in that range. I remember trying to find it on the state tournament website after seeing the scores on the OBB archive but I couldn't find whatever year it was.

You're kinda right. In 2006 the top four were within 4 points, and there was also a tie between Carmel and Riley for 3rd and 4th. 5th was about 15 points away.

[SOPomo]

what are the top 3 most competitive states?

It's impossible to have this discussion without defining what "competitive" means. If it means the closest competition, that can mean something very different than the toughest competition.

Yeah. Let's define it as toughest.

I would put CA's top five against any other state. Give me Kennedy, Churchill, Kraemer, Jeffrey Trail, and either Miller/Oak Valley.

[EastStroudsburg13]

It's impossible to have this discussion without defining what "competitive" means. If it means the closest competition, that can mean something very different than the toughest competition.

Yeah. Let's define it as toughest.

I would put CA's top five against any other state. Give me Kennedy, Churchill, Kraemer, Jeffrey Trail, and either Miller/Oak Valley.

I think that's fair. I would also agree that California has the toughest teams in both divisions, with Ohio the only state coming close.

[sciolyperson1]

Yeah. Let's define it as toughest.

I would put CA's top five against any other state. Give me Kennedy, Churchill, Kraemer, Jeffrey Trail, and either Miller/Oak Valley.

I think that's fair. I would also agree that California has the toughest teams in both divisions, with Ohio the only state coming close.

I would argue that while California certainly has great teams, Illinois/Ohio are the only ones that consistently exceed all others - since 2008, only 2014B has been non-Illinois/Ohio teams for div B. In fact, a California team has never won Div B nats (except in 1987 lol) - although Churchill did come extremely close 3 times. This might be the year, especially with Kennedy being such a powerhouse school.

[MadCow2357]

I would put CA's top five against any other state. Give me Kennedy, Churchill, Kraemer, Jeffrey Trail, and either Miller/Oak Valley.

I think that's fair. I would also agree that California has the toughest teams in both divisions, with Ohio the only state coming close.

I would argue that while California certainly has great teams, Illinois/Ohio are the only ones that consistently exceed all others - since 2008, only 2014B, 2016C, and 2008C have been non-Illinois/Ohio teams. In fact, a California team has never won Div B nats (except in 1987 lol) - although Churchill did come extremely close 3 times. This might be the year, especially with Kennedy being such a powerhouse school.

One thing that I find worth considering - if Churchill had remained at its 2016/2017 strength, and hadn't lost its coach (I heard that the coach left?), would Kennedy still be winning Norcal? I may be wrong here, but it seems that Kennedy has only risen because of Churchill's "fall".

[EastStroudsburg13]

I would put CA's top five against any other state. Give me Kennedy, Churchill, Kraemer, Jeffrey Trail, and either Miller/Oak Valley.

I think that's fair. I would also agree that California has the toughest teams in both divisions, with Ohio the only state coming close.

I would argue that while California certainly has great teams, Illinois/Ohio are the only ones that consistently exceed all others - since 2008, only 2014B, 2016C, and 2008C have been non-Illinois/Ohio teams. In fact, a California team has never won Div B nats (except in 1987 lol) - although Churchill did come extremely close 3 times. This might be the year, especially with Kennedy being such a powerhouse school.

Illinois B is very strong, but with Illinois C only placing in the top 5 once in the 21st century, I don't think it matches California or Ohio, which have been strong in both divisions. If we're talking history, I would agree that Ohio is the more historically dominant state; however, if we're talking present day, I would say California is currently tougher than Ohio.

One thing that I find worth considering - if Churchill had remained at its 2016/2017 strength, and hadn't lost its coach (I heard that the coach left?), would Kennedy still be winning Norcal? I may be wrong here, but it seems that Kennedy has only risen because of Churchill's "fall".

That's a fair question; I think Churchill losing a step definitely motivated Kennedy, but this year's Kennedy appears clearly stronger than last year's. I think it would be a very close match between 2017 Churchill and 2019 Kennedy, one that unfortunately is left to hypotheticals.

[NorCalplaya]

I think that's fair. I would also agree that California has the toughest teams in both divisions, with Ohio the only state coming close.

I would argue that while California certainly has great teams, Illinois/Ohio are the only ones that consistently exceed all others - since 2008, only 2014B, 2016C, and 2008C have been non-Illinois/Ohio teams. In fact, a California team has never won Div B nats (except in 1987 lol) - although Churchill did come extremely close 3 times. This might be the year, especially with Kennedy being such a powerhouse school.

One thing that I find worth considering - if Churchill had remained at its 2016/2017 strength, and hadn't lost its coach (I heard that the coach left?), would Kennedy still be winning Norcal? I may be wrong here, but it seems that Kennedy has only risen because of Churchill's "fall".

Churchill Took a hard hit because of the coach, but they def made a recovery. Last year they ended 3rd at states, this year they medaled in the same amount of events as kennedy (if not more, I'm not in that division), but they bombed 2 events. They were close to kennedy this year at states.

[builderguy135]

I think that's fair. I would also agree that California has the toughest teams in both divisions, with Ohio the only state coming close.

I would argue that while California certainly has great teams, Illinois/Ohio are the only ones that consistently exceed all others - since 2008, only 2014B, 2016C, and 2008C have been non-Illinois/Ohio teams. In fact, a California team has never won Div B nats (except in 1987 lol) - although Churchill did come extremely close 3 times. This might be the year, especially with Kennedy being such a powerhouse school.

Illinois B is very strong, but with Illinois C only placing in the top 5 once in the 21st century, I don't think it matches California or Ohio, which have been strong in both divisions. If we're talking history, I would agree that Ohio is the more historically dominant state; however, if we're talking present day, I would say California is currently tougher than Ohio.

One thing that I find worth considering - if Churchill had remained at its 2016/2017 strength, and hadn't lost its coach (I heard that the coach left?), would Kennedy still be winning Norcal? I may be wrong here, but it seems that Kennedy has only risen because of Churchill's "fall".

That's a fair question; I think Churchill losing a step definitely motivated Kennedy, but this year's Kennedy appears clearly stronger than last year's. I think it would be a very close match between 2017 Churchill and 2019 Kennedy, one that unfortunately is left to hypotheticals.

This is probably an unpopular opinion but I feel that Kennedy is just as strong, if not a bit weaker, than last year.

2017 (Churchill) - 47 points, 13 golds, 20 top 3 placements.
2018 (Kennedy) - 62 points, 9 golds, 16 top 3 placements.
2019 (Kennedy) - 71 points, 9 golds, 16 top 3 placements.

Although the medals look similar, there were a similar amount of bombs both years Kennedy won. In 2018, their worst placements were 12, 7, 6, 5. In 2019, their worst placements were 11, 9, 8, 5. In general, I feel like they're a little more inconsistent.

They're still probably going to place in the top 3 at nats though.