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Re: Illinois 2013
Posted: April 23rd, 2013, 12:06 pm
by Skink
Information comes from four primary areas:
1. experience
2. invitationals
3. initiative
4. formal training
I think I wrote something similar last season at this time, incidentally (but that's gone now...). Anyway, take any two of the above for a fair bit of success. #2 is huge. There are reasons the teams in southern and western IL are not nearly as well-equipped as those in Chicagoland. This is one of them. Every team has had to iron out some sort of difficulty at an invitational at some point or another. You know they saying, practice makes perfect.
Coaches in the know help, but having a doctorate in a science field or even being a rules writer (both of which I can think of IL State team examples for that aren't the top teams) does not make the team a shoe-in. Rather, support from two of the following three will make a strong team, in B, anyway:
1. the coach(es)
2. the parents
3. the school
Re: Illinois 2013
Posted: April 23rd, 2013, 12:07 pm
by tuftedtitmouse12
Skink wrote:
Coaches in the know help, but having a doctorate in a science field or even being a rules writer (both of which I can think of IL State team examples for that aren't the top teams) does not make the team a shoe-in. Rather, support from two of the following three will make a strong team, in B, anyway:
1. the coach(es)
2. the parents
3. the school
Essentially support, yes?
Re: Illinois 2013
Posted: April 23rd, 2013, 12:09 pm
by Skink
Yeah, that concept's simple and not winning me any prizes for noting
Re: Illinois 2013
Posted: April 23rd, 2013, 12:12 pm
by tuftedtitmouse12
What would number 4 be? (the "formal training". Would that be the coaches/someone with more knowledge in an event?)
Re: Illinois 2013
Posted: April 23rd, 2013, 12:16 pm
by Skink
Summer Institute...Coaches' Clinic...a coach/parent getting coached by an experienced coach or director on how to 'do' SO...stuff like that. You could, in theory, have a rookie coach start a great team if they were led in the right direction by someone knowledgeable. Does this happen often? Doubt it. Anyway, the influence the aforementioned training sessions have shouldn't be overlooked. Even the aviation clinic for trial events that's been held at DW every year probably helps those teams admitted tremendously. At least, I'd like to think so. It kinda costs money...
I'd like to think folks glean a lot of useful information from these forums, too, but I'm not so sure. It's hard to find useful information in those event threads sometimes.
Re: Illinois 2013
Posted: April 23rd, 2013, 12:19 pm
by tuftedtitmouse12
But would it help if a coach for a single event knew about that event? Wouldn't it all boil down to the student taking initiative? Would it be better to have a coach who knew the event or no coach at all? Or a coach who didn't know the event?
Re: Illinois 2013
Posted: April 23rd, 2013, 12:20 pm
by mrsteven
"1. experience
2. invitationals
3. initiative
4. formal training"
I dont think you give enough credit for initiative. Thats really what leads to success. For some of the people I know, we dont go to a whole lot of invites. I think my team went to 2 this year, and even then both of them I was helping my coach run whatever event. Experience? I think none is needed, you learn as you go. Formal training? Ok, that one did help me quite a bit with the 3d printer.
But i think truly the desire to do well will make all of those other things come true. You gain experience from it, you learn more, and you become the expert.
In terms of resources, the best one of all 3 years I did scioly was for sure this website. I learned so much from so many people hearing about their successes and failures and people thinking about new ideas. We dont have any involved coaches or parents, but being here to ask questions to people like anderson, chalker, wlsguy and balsaman for sure shaped the way I think and the amount of success I was able to attain over the last few years
Re: Illinois 2013
Posted: April 23rd, 2013, 12:30 pm
by Skink
tuftedtitmouse12 wrote:But would it help if a coach for a single event knew about that event?
No, it wouldn't help if a coach for an event knew nothing about the material they were responsible for teaching 
Wouldn't it all boil down to the student taking initiative? It could. You could have bad or no coaches and dedicated students OR unmotivated students and good coaches with compulsory practice both giving the same results. Ideally, you'd have contributions from both parties. Throw in parents and teachers for good measure.
Would it be better to have a coach who knew the event or no coach at all? Regardless what division you're in, it is always helpful to either have access to someone who is resource (knowledgeable in the event) or be one yourself. It's not required, but it's always better. I don't see no coach and no parent support as beneficial, in any way. It may not be detrimental, but it certainly doesn't help to have less assistance when needed. Places like this help. There are many resources hovering around the forums.
Or a coach who didn't know the event? Again, under no circumstances would you expect a coach unfamiliar with the material to be better than a coach who is intimately familiar with it. It's not necessarily a bad thing. Plenty of coaches learn or relearn the material along with their teams. I don't know how it goes so much in the competitive C division teams, of course.
Steven-tell them that.
Reading back, I know initiative helps, but that's for a smaller subset of teams, really. The really motivated competitors. Wasn't someone just saying they crammed days before State? That doesn't scream 'initiative' to me. 
Eh, it doesn't really scream any of the other stuff from my list, either...
Re: Illinois 2013
Posted: April 23rd, 2013, 12:35 pm
by tuftedtitmouse12
I agree with Steven. Initiative is preferrably supposed to be longterm, resulting in really good placements (If we're talking about SO specifically) but even when you're cramming, you're technically taking the initiative to start studying, if you twist the words a bit. Soo, isn't cramming/studying the same as taking initiative? (So long as no one is forcing you)
Re: Illinois 2013
Posted: April 23rd, 2013, 12:38 pm
by Skink
Eh...
initiative n.
The power or ability to begin or to follow through energetically with a plan or task; enterprise and determination
That one's up to you. You could say so.