Bad Event Coordinators
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Re: Bad Event Coordinators
hmm... what about appeals after awards? two years ago, I got a no show score for an event I attended...
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Re: Bad Event Coordinators
After awards it would be too late, some teams would probably leave before awards and most would definitely leave immediately after. The fact that we stuck around last year at states was the only reason that we knew we got 3rd rather than 4th- and even then the team announced as third had already left.
Olathe North HS, 2011-2013 | National Runner-Up, Sounds of Music (2012)
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Re: Bad Event Coordinators
You might be interested in knowing the policy related to this for Nationals. I assume many State tournaments have the same policy.zyzzyva98 wrote:After awards it would be too late, some teams would probably leave before awards and most would definitely leave immediately after. The fact that we stuck around last year at states was the only reason that we knew we got 3rd rather than 4th- and even then the team announced as third had already left.
http://soinc.org/scoring_guidelines
Note: NATIONAL TOURNAMENT SCORING POLICY- At the end of the Science Olympiad National Awards Ceremony each team’s head coach will be provided one copy of the final scores. Places are tentative and may change if any scoring inconsistencies are brought to the attention of the arbitrators and verified within one hour after the ceremony is completed. If changes occur, the appropriate medals and trophies will be awarded. Scores for the National Science Olympiad are not official until they are posted on the soinc.org website.
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Re: Bad Event Coordinators
Soccerkid,soccerkid812 wrote:I agree.dholdgreve wrote:Event Coordinators are no different than the competitors... The vast majority understand the rules, and really make an effort to educate themselves... I've run many events in both B and C, and by no means profess to know as much about the events as some of the teams, but I at least want to know the event well enough to not embarrass myself. Now take a minute and look at the flip side of the coin. How many times, after spending countless hours in the shop building a sand dispenser and testing aparatus to use at an upcoming competition, have I have "competitors" come in with bridges that were 5 CM too short, and couldn't even be tested? Kids with Boomilevers that had to be weighed on the sand scale because the gram scale wouldn't read high enough? Kids that rolled their boom in on wagon, because it was too heavy to carry! Kids that show up to forensics without any goggles or aprons... It can be just as disheartening to the event coordinator that spends hours prepping for an event, then proctoring an event where the kids have obviously not even looked at the rules... There are exceptions on both sides of this discussion.
But when the student does something wrong, then it will affect only himself/herself and their team.
But if an event coordinator does something wrong, then it will affect everyone and could be the decision between going to state/nationals for different teams.
I partially agree with what you are saying... I personally feel that an Event coordinator should be held to a higher standard, if not by the event coordinators,then by his or her own code of ethics. If you are not willing to commit to run the most fair and comprehensive competition with the most current information available, then step aside, and allow someone else to step up. I've seen comments about how every E/C from regionals up should be "credentialed." I've also seen many "credentialed" E/Cs that have barely read the rules and threw together a halfassed test at the last minute based on last years rules or test that they were given as a sample. But remember, if a student does something wrong, will most certainly affect his or her personal performance, may affect the teams overall placement and performance and quite possibly can affect the placement of other teams near their team, by moving their own position.
Dan Holdgreve
Northmont Science Olympiad
Dedicated to the Memory of Len Joeris
"For the betterment of Science"
Northmont Science Olympiad
Dedicated to the Memory of Len Joeris
"For the betterment of Science"
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Re: Bad Event Coordinators
In every competition I have been at you can't appeal if you don't leave the device with the judge.kjhsscioly wrote:I wouldn't leave it with the judge.
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Re: Bad Event Coordinators
Story time!
Pretty much everyone from my school knows this story, it's become sort of a running joke.
So, I did Food Science the very first year it came out as a trial event in Nationals (I was in 8th grade). My partner and I studied a bit and did the few practice events we could find online. So it's the day of the competition and we show up a couple of minutes late to the event because we couldn't find the room. We get started, and I look at the written portion; it's EXACTLY the same as one I found online, so I fill it out quickly and confidently.
With that out of the way, we start doing the lab portion. The first station gives us two bananas; one ripe and one unripe. The first question is "Taste the bananas. Which banana is sweeter?". This seemed weird, so we asked the supervisor. He actually stops the entire event and, quite rudely, goes "Everyone, are we supposed to eat the banana?" and the rest of the teams reply "no". He apparently said so before the event started, but we missed it because we came late. So we we said "fine, whatever" and continued with our event. It said "Test the sugar content of the banana by using Benedict's solution". We only had a tiny test tube, so we smushed some banana into it and added the solution. We couldn't find a hot water bath, so we asked the supervisor and he said "You don't need to heat it". We're like "Um...yes we do, it's Benedict's solution, it won't show any results unless we heat it". He refused to listen to us, so we just went back and said the logical answer (the ripe banana has more sugar than the unripe banana).
Then we go to the next station, consisting of ground up cereal in a beaker; we were to test for iron content by putting a magnetic bar in the cereal. I follow the instructions, which say "Add water to the cereal". I do so and it's not really doing anything. So we call the supervisor over and he says very rudely "You're OBVIOUSLY supposed to add THIS much water, jeez". And by now, I've had it with this terrible event and this rude supervisor, so I said "Well, it didn't SAY how much water we needed to add, your event sucks".
He angrily walks away. We finish the event and leave. After the award ceremony, we look at the results; we got 61st in Food Science. Out of 60 teams. Yep, we got disqualified because I told the judge his event sucked. Luckily, it was only a trial event so it didn't impact our team score, and one of the coaches told everyone we got DQed because I roundhouse kicked the judge in the face. So looking back on it, it was pretty funny, but man, that event really did suck. And the joke's on the supervisor, because the year after that, my partner and I got 4th place at Nationals in Food Science when it became a real event.
Pretty much everyone from my school knows this story, it's become sort of a running joke.
So, I did Food Science the very first year it came out as a trial event in Nationals (I was in 8th grade). My partner and I studied a bit and did the few practice events we could find online. So it's the day of the competition and we show up a couple of minutes late to the event because we couldn't find the room. We get started, and I look at the written portion; it's EXACTLY the same as one I found online, so I fill it out quickly and confidently.
With that out of the way, we start doing the lab portion. The first station gives us two bananas; one ripe and one unripe. The first question is "Taste the bananas. Which banana is sweeter?". This seemed weird, so we asked the supervisor. He actually stops the entire event and, quite rudely, goes "Everyone, are we supposed to eat the banana?" and the rest of the teams reply "no". He apparently said so before the event started, but we missed it because we came late. So we we said "fine, whatever" and continued with our event. It said "Test the sugar content of the banana by using Benedict's solution". We only had a tiny test tube, so we smushed some banana into it and added the solution. We couldn't find a hot water bath, so we asked the supervisor and he said "You don't need to heat it". We're like "Um...yes we do, it's Benedict's solution, it won't show any results unless we heat it". He refused to listen to us, so we just went back and said the logical answer (the ripe banana has more sugar than the unripe banana).
Then we go to the next station, consisting of ground up cereal in a beaker; we were to test for iron content by putting a magnetic bar in the cereal. I follow the instructions, which say "Add water to the cereal". I do so and it's not really doing anything. So we call the supervisor over and he says very rudely "You're OBVIOUSLY supposed to add THIS much water, jeez". And by now, I've had it with this terrible event and this rude supervisor, so I said "Well, it didn't SAY how much water we needed to add, your event sucks".
He angrily walks away. We finish the event and leave. After the award ceremony, we look at the results; we got 61st in Food Science. Out of 60 teams. Yep, we got disqualified because I told the judge his event sucked. Luckily, it was only a trial event so it didn't impact our team score, and one of the coaches told everyone we got DQed because I roundhouse kicked the judge in the face. So looking back on it, it was pretty funny, but man, that event really did suck. And the joke's on the supervisor, because the year after that, my partner and I got 4th place at Nationals in Food Science when it became a real event.
2009 events:
Fossils: 1st @ reg. 3rd @ states (stupid dinosaurs...) 5th @ nats.
Dynamic: 1st @ reg. 19thish @ states, 18th @ nats
Herpetology (NOT the study of herpes): NA
Enviro Chem: 39th @ states =(
Cell Bio: 9th @ reg. 18th @ nats
Remote: 6th @ states 3rd @ Nats
Ecology: 5th @ Nats
Fossils: 1st @ reg. 3rd @ states (stupid dinosaurs...) 5th @ nats.
Dynamic: 1st @ reg. 19thish @ states, 18th @ nats
Herpetology (NOT the study of herpes): NA
Enviro Chem: 39th @ states =(
Cell Bio: 9th @ reg. 18th @ nats
Remote: 6th @ states 3rd @ Nats
Ecology: 5th @ Nats
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Re: Bad Event Coordinators
O.o
Ok honestly, these supervisors are VOLUNTEERS right? Why are they even doing this if they don't want to put effort into it and act like young children's petty little questions are below....Again, this isn't directed at all supervisors, but those similar to the one mentioned by Gneiss.
Ok honestly, these supervisors are VOLUNTEERS right? Why are they even doing this if they don't want to put effort into it and act like young children's petty little questions are below....Again, this isn't directed at all supervisors, but those similar to the one mentioned by Gneiss.
2011 Season Events~
Fossils (Regionals ~1st) (State ~6th)
Towers (Regionals ~1st) (State ~3rd)
Helicopter (Regionals -3rd gahhh) (State ~5th)
Wind Power (Regionals ~1st) (State ~3rd TIERED!)
Hooray for getting everything i wanted?
Fossils (Regionals ~1st) (State ~6th)
Towers (Regionals ~1st) (State ~3rd)
Helicopter (Regionals -3rd gahhh) (State ~5th)
Wind Power (Regionals ~1st) (State ~3rd TIERED!)
Hooray for getting everything i wanted?
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Re: Bad Event Coordinators
Our team is new and somewhat naive. It really hurts to put in all that preparation for an event only to get to the tournament and see that the event is so different from what you prepped for or studied that the competition has turned into no more than a roll of the dice...
In our three times at regionals and three at state we've run in to:
1) A bird test that included a bunch of state birds. Our state website (which we checked often) never mentioned we'd be tested on it.
2) A robocross that had a substandard board (the edging was different from what was described) and event coordinator on his cell phone during impound time saying "And, you need a freezer container and legos and some batteries."
3) A WIDI supervisor that lost the first page of our writer's writing. The team got back to our table and the do-er said to his sister (the writer), "So, why did you NOT give me the equipment list this time after all that practice?" A little visit to the event coordinator led us to discover that the first sheet of her instructions ended up stapled to the bottom of another team's instructions. Honest mistake but we still came in dead last on WIDI. The brother and sister quit the team (it was their first and last year)
4) A cell bio test that had ONE question regarding cell biology. Other questions had to do with space aliens and interpreting the meaning of bumper stickers.
5) At state last year, one team decided it would show up to knowledge events whenever it pleased, and event supervisors let them because they told the supervisors (who were intimidated) "our coach told us to come now."
6) BLG that flew in a hall where the fan turned on and off during the event. The team before us had a great flight because the fan was off and we had a horrid flight when the fan turned on halfway during our flight.
7) Mousetrap (C Div) and battery buggy were run on a tile floor that had huge dips and bumps. The tile was that decorative type that is all lumpy and the grout was wide and deep. Cars were hopping and bumping all over the place.
8) A supervisor decided to "help" my daughter and her teammate put the bridge on the testing board and they weren't expecting his help and somehow, with three pairs of hands, the bridge broke. To his credit, he let the girls reglue the bridge and have a later time to test it, but they did not do as well as they had hoped.
That's the nature of the beast.
In our three times at regionals and three at state we've run in to:
1) A bird test that included a bunch of state birds. Our state website (which we checked often) never mentioned we'd be tested on it.
2) A robocross that had a substandard board (the edging was different from what was described) and event coordinator on his cell phone during impound time saying "And, you need a freezer container and legos and some batteries."
3) A WIDI supervisor that lost the first page of our writer's writing. The team got back to our table and the do-er said to his sister (the writer), "So, why did you NOT give me the equipment list this time after all that practice?" A little visit to the event coordinator led us to discover that the first sheet of her instructions ended up stapled to the bottom of another team's instructions. Honest mistake but we still came in dead last on WIDI. The brother and sister quit the team (it was their first and last year)
4) A cell bio test that had ONE question regarding cell biology. Other questions had to do with space aliens and interpreting the meaning of bumper stickers.
5) At state last year, one team decided it would show up to knowledge events whenever it pleased, and event supervisors let them because they told the supervisors (who were intimidated) "our coach told us to come now."
6) BLG that flew in a hall where the fan turned on and off during the event. The team before us had a great flight because the fan was off and we had a horrid flight when the fan turned on halfway during our flight.
7) Mousetrap (C Div) and battery buggy were run on a tile floor that had huge dips and bumps. The tile was that decorative type that is all lumpy and the grout was wide and deep. Cars were hopping and bumping all over the place.
8) A supervisor decided to "help" my daughter and her teammate put the bridge on the testing board and they weren't expecting his help and somehow, with three pairs of hands, the bridge broke. To his credit, he let the girls reglue the bridge and have a later time to test it, but they did not do as well as they had hoped.
That's the nature of the beast.
Homeschool Science Colorado since August 2008
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Re: Bad Event Coordinators
I think I reached the limit for the previous post as it's acting squirrelly when I try to add to it...
LESSONS LEARNED:
1) Thank the supervisors that do a nice job.
2) Don't argue with supervisors. Report problems to your coach.
3) Bring spare test boards (after one bad year at Robocross we brought a "spec" test board and all the Regional teams used it because it was right and the supervisor's board was wrong). So, if your event has a board (such as tower) pack a spec test board in your car the day of the event.
4) Bring copies of the event rules and the most current FAQs and clarifications.
5) If you have questions for the event coordinators (especially for building events) ask them during impound.
LESSONS LEARNED:
1) Thank the supervisors that do a nice job.
2) Don't argue with supervisors. Report problems to your coach.
3) Bring spare test boards (after one bad year at Robocross we brought a "spec" test board and all the Regional teams used it because it was right and the supervisor's board was wrong). So, if your event has a board (such as tower) pack a spec test board in your car the day of the event.
4) Bring copies of the event rules and the most current FAQs and clarifications.
5) If you have questions for the event coordinators (especially for building events) ask them during impound.
Homeschool Science Colorado since August 2008