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Re: Forestry B/C
Posted: August 5th, 2023, 10:34 am
by treesdea
pumptato-cat wrote: ↑August 2nd, 2023, 1:46 pm
I wouldn't risk it. Having the guide split into two sounds annoying, and you might run into some trouble with event supervisors(this is why you bring a copy of the rules and Event Clarifications on soinc.org to competitions).
However, if you already have that specific guide I can see why you wouldn't want to purchase two. Going off of my R&M knowledge and 2023's rules, I would suggest you submit a question to soinc.org. The rules just say "a field guide," which is vague.
https://www.soinc.org/events/frequently-asked-questions
How do I submit a question?
Re: Forestry B/C
Posted: August 5th, 2023, 11:31 am
by hterrapin
pumptato-cat wrote: ↑August 2nd, 2023, 1:46 pm
However, if you already have that specific guide I can see why you wouldn't want to purchase two.
Our teachers have the eastern and western field guides separated and we just borrowed those.
Re: Forestry B/C
Posted: August 5th, 2023, 11:47 am
by kokonattsu
treesdea wrote: ↑August 5th, 2023, 10:34 am
pumptato-cat wrote: ↑August 2nd, 2023, 1:46 pm
I wouldn't risk it. Having the guide split into two sounds annoying, and you might run into some trouble with event supervisors(this is why you bring a copy of the rules and Event Clarifications on soinc.org to competitions).
However, if you already have that specific guide I can see why you wouldn't want to purchase two. Going off of my R&M knowledge and 2023's rules, I would suggest you submit a question to soinc.org. The rules just say "a field guide," which is vague.
https://www.soinc.org/events/frequently-asked-questions
How do I submit a question?
I think it's too late to submit a question, should be open in the season though.
Re: Forestry B/C
Posted: August 5th, 2023, 11:48 am
by kokonattsu
treesdea wrote: ↑August 2nd, 2023, 1:33 pm
onshape wrote: ↑August 2nd, 2023, 12:25 pm
treesdea wrote: ↑August 2nd, 2023, 7:05 am
Question:
For the Audubon Society field guide, are we allowed to have both the eastern and western versions as a field guide, or do we need to have the entire thing in a single book?
I always thought we could only have one book. What's the need for two field guides, anyway?
Some versions of the Audubon Society field guide have it split into two separate guides.
There's a good version I use with a lot of trees and overal nice aesthetic, and it isn't split. Link in the answer.
Re: Forestry B/C
Posted: August 7th, 2023, 11:15 am
by Thenerdicat
I'm late to the conversation but if I remember correctly, the Forestry taxonomy and tree names are named using the Audubon Society field guides--I do remember seeing the field guide being split into East/West, and I thought that was the only version of the field guides available for purchase...which would make it kind of inconvenient for competition because a. rules only allow one field guide and b. you could theoretically only bring the East or West edition to the competition if the competition you're attending is local enough and writers are lazy enough to only ask about trees from your area...but the list encompasses more or less the majority of the entire continent. I didn't know there was a version of both East and West guides combined! I might purchase it for collecting purposes because uh...my partner and I already focus on Sibley's
. If only that was made to be more available as public knowledge...that would've been great. My take is that SOINC really should've clarified that in the rules because it seems unfair to base the entire list from a field guide that encompasses the entire continent but when people look for said field guide it's split in half. Then again, my partner has possession of the field guide (almost entirely) and we've like...barely used it in competition. I'm biased though--I've only gone to in-state competitions, take all of what I've said with a grain of salt. Just my two cents on this!
Re: Forestry B/C
Posted: August 9th, 2023, 4:30 pm
by sc95837
treesdea wrote: ↑August 2nd, 2023, 7:05 am
Question:
For the Audubon Society field guide, are we allowed to have both the eastern and western versions as a field guide, or do we need to have the entire thing in a single book?
The 2023 rules say "Each team may also have one commercially produced field guide which may be tabbed or annotated." Even though the Eastern and Western books cover their own regions, they are separate books, with overlap among them. I doubt that they'd be considered different volumes of the same book (especially because of overlap) and even if they were, it'd still be iffy.
Our middle-school's folks took one of them (I think western? I don't remember)
Re: Forestry B/C
Posted: August 10th, 2023, 10:46 pm
by Thenerdicat
sc95837 wrote: ↑August 9th, 2023, 4:30 pm
treesdea wrote: ↑August 2nd, 2023, 7:05 am
Question:
For the Audubon Society field guide, are we allowed to have both the eastern and western versions as a field guide, or do we need to have the entire thing in a single book?
The 2023 rules say "Each team may also have one commercially produced field guide which may be tabbed or annotated." Even though the Eastern and Western books cover their own regions, they are separate books, with overlap among them. I doubt that they'd be considered different volumes of the same book (especially because of overlap) and even if they were, it'd still be iffy.
Our middle-school's folks took one of them (I think western? I don't remember)
^ What Shrey said--I do think getting your hands on a combined East-West Audubon guide (because this thread has shown that that is a possibility) is worth it because rules (at least--the list and its taxonomy) are written off of Audubon's guide but what do I know, I am alas a Sibley user
Re: Forestry B/C
Posted: August 11th, 2023, 11:18 am
by onshape
Definitely use the recommended edition. Isn't it good enough if it's what they tell you to use?
Re: Forestry B/C
Posted: August 12th, 2023, 10:15 am
by kokonattsu
onshape wrote: ↑August 11th, 2023, 11:18 am
Definitely use the recommended edition. Isn't it good enough if it's what they tell you to use?
Overall not bad, although it doesn't get too specific imo. To me the guide is more of a backup incase the binder doesn't have enough info, or the binder doesn't have range maps or whatever.
Re: Forestry B/C
Posted: August 13th, 2023, 1:43 pm
by Thenerdicat
onshape wrote: ↑August 11th, 2023, 11:18 am
Definitely use the recommended edition. Isn't it good enough if it's what they tell you to use?
I mean yeah, it would be easier if said recommended edition was more easy to find online and in stores (when I was googling around early season I could only find the split Eastern/Western versions and the same happened in-store) that honestly...it's not really worth it in my books. Adding onto that, the combined Audubon version wasn't a thing until 2021 and despite its mention in rules it was NOT very easy to find and there wasn't much noise around where to find the combined version...so honestly I went for Sibley's because it was less of a hassle. Also, I never really used a field guide in-competition that much, most of it was my partner anyways.
. If only that was made to be more available as public knowledge...that would've been great. My take is that SOINC really should've clarified that in the rules because it seems unfair to base the entire list from a field guide that encompasses the entire continent but when people look for said field guide it's split in half. Then again, my partner has possession of the field guide (almost entirely) and we've like...barely used it in competition. I'm biased though--I've only gone to in-state competitions, take all of what I've said with a grain of salt. Just my two cents on this!