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I think that if you look up simple machines, you'll quickly figure out what works and what doesn't. It isn't the MATERIAL that defines the task, it's the OPERATION. It's simpler than you think once you do a miniscule amount of research.

missionimpossible wrote:What would be an example of this type of simple machine? Also could this double up as the wedge one by having a screw push the wedge between two objects?

I would think that you can do both tasks. So long as the screw turns, then pushes a wedge. You are using one task to start the other. BUT, if the screw is still pushing the wedge as the wedge pushes apart the blocks, would that count as parallel tasks???

illusionist wrote:

missionimpossible wrote:What would be an example of this type of simple machine? Also could this double up as the wedge one by having a screw push the wedge between two objects?

I would think that you can do both tasks. So long as the screw turns, then pushes a wedge. You are using one task to start the other. BUT, if the screw is still pushing the wedge as the wedge pushes apart the blocks, would that count as parallel tasks???

This really should be allowed. Combining the balloon task with the chemical reaction is entirely the same situation, and the National FAQ allows it.

In this case, though, don't risk it. You need to have clear definitions between tasks; for example, screw moves object, THEN wedge pushes block.

I've seen it multiple times. It's legal.

Where is this oddball definition of parallel tasks coming from?

Uncle Fester wrote:I've seen it multiple times. It's legal.

Where is this oddball definition of parallel tasks coming from?

From event supervisors who don't agree. I've always been told to make sure there's a clear distinction between tasks.

This is the line of reasoning I was given (put in terms of this years tasks): Task f requires that you turn a screw so it moves an object, causing the next action. Task b requires that you use a force to move a wedge between two objects, causing them to separate and cause the next action. Therefore, the screw must cause an entirely separate task b; ie, a different force that moves a wedge between two objects. Otherwise, you're counting the screw/wedge mechanism as a double task.

Primate wrote:

Uncle Fester wrote:I've seen it multiple times. It's legal.

Where is this oddball definition of parallel tasks coming from?

From event supervisors who don't agree. I've always been told to make sure there's a clear distinction between tasks.

This is the line of reasoning I was given (put in terms of this years tasks): Task f requires that you turn a screw so it moves an object, causing the next action. Task b requires that you use a force to move a wedge between two objects, causing them to separate and cause the next action. Therefore, the screw must cause an entirely separate task b; ie, a different force that moves a wedge between two objects. Otherwise, you're counting the screw/wedge mechanism as a double task.

That wasn't at States, was it? That was WLI?

In my opinion, it would be fine, so long as the screw moves the wedge two centimeters first, then the pushes the wedge between two objects, causing them to separate. Same thing, I also think it would be okay to use the screw to push a syringe for the Hydraulic task.

Flavorflav wrote:That wasn't at States, was it? That was WLI?

Noo, it wasn't. I'm actually Midwestern, and it was last year anyway . The event supervisor is one of the nicest people I've ever met (for better or worse), so he let it slide, but any other supervisor who shared his views wouldn't have counted those tasks.

illusionist wrote:In my opinion, it would be fine, so long as the screw moves the wedge two centimeters first, then the pushes the wedge between two objects, causing them to separate. Same thing, I also think it would be okay to use the screw to push a syringe for the Hydraulic task.

But see, how does moving the wedge two centimeters cause the next action?

The wedge is pushed two cm by the screw. Then the screw pushes the wedge to separate the objects. So the wedge has to travel 2cm before touching the objects it will separate.

illusionist wrote:The wedge is pushed two cm by the screw. Then the screw pushes the wedge to separate the objects. So the wedge has to travel 2cm before touching the objects it will separate.

Right, but the motion of the wedge doesn't trigger the next task. Something triggers the screw, the wedge moves 2cm. The wedge, however, doesn't trigger anything at this point; the screw just keeps turning and pushes the wedge between two objects.

Go with Uncle Fester on this; it appears my event supervisor was mistaken. Just be aware of the problems you might run into.