What makes a team successful?

[Unome]

13 ninth graders on a B team? Surely, spread over 3 B teams.......

Only spread over two teams with alternates

As for "being doomed" because of coaches... The coaches, specifically div C, dont have nearly as much impact as the students self motivation. Some people on the teams that place low simply just don't spend as much time or don't have partners that spend time on their events.

Also, to some extent, team culture can be a big driving force. For you, Scott, being from Solon, I'm sure that the fact that you guys are consistently very high placing at nats probably drives kids because they know they can achieve this or they don't want to be the kids who don't place very high at nats

Yup. Motivation, invitationals, and past success are what seem to be the biggest drivers to me.

As my coach always puts it: "Solon and Mentor aren't demigods". In Ohio, these are the two highest performing teams (not forgetting you, Mason, Centerville, Westlake!).

You did forget Chardon though they were pretty close behind the top 4 in 2015 and 2016 (for certain values of "close").

[ScottMaurer19]

I would definitely agree in the cultural aspect. The competitive environment drives the team members to improve.

I can only speak from my experiences but a larger team also would help. If the team only had 15 people then you wouldn't have to fight for your spot at states.

[EastStroudsburg13]

Well the thing is that my school's been competing for 7+ years and haven't been able to crack top 20 except for 2015. If the coaches are the problem, does that mean our school is just doomed forever?

You're not doomed forever, but it is very difficult to have team success at the B Division level without very involved coaches. Individual success is definitely possible, but it usually takes an adult influence to be able to motivate and corral 15 middle schoolers together.

[ScottMaurer19]

Well the thing is that my school's been competing for 7+ years and haven't been able to crack top 20 except for 2015. If the coaches are the problem, does that mean our school is just doomed forever?

You're not doomed forever, but it is very difficult to have team success at the B Division level without very involved coaches. Individual success is definitely possible, but it usually takes an adult influence to be able to motivate and corral 15 middle schoolers together.

In div B the coaches are especially important. Not only do the students need to be motivated but each individual event needs a coach to teach the students not only the material in the event, but HOW to study for these events. If they are taught how to study in div B then these skiils are later used at the High School.

[Entomology]

It's important to note that everything in Socal is shifting tremendously, in division B especially.

As everyone else before me has said, a part of it has to do with coaches. Here in San Diego (I have heard this practice is not as common outside of our area) we have 23 event coaches, along with a coordinating committee and 2-3 assistant coaches for each event. Over 40 adults/Division C helpers are invested in the program, and this is true for even the schools that do not perform "as well". I have additionally heard that some LA/OC schools have event coaches too, but I am not sure to what extent this is true.

On a different note, I am convinced that the success of a team has more to do with dedication and motivation. The want and the drive to succeed. Despite Oak Valley losing to the kids I coach at regionals by over 50 points, their team is extremely motivated and has a crazy good work ethic. They really stepped it up and came through at state--which resulted in them dominating the competition. And they don't even have the 9th graders or the semi-permanent head coach that a bevy of Socal school teams have. They're just kids who want to do well so they work for it--and they work for it hard.

Don't doubt yourself, and don't doubt your team. Doubt is the single worst thing an olympian can have. The past results your team has received do not determine your future placings. One of my coaches always told us this quote by J.M Barrie: "The moment you doubt whether you can fly, you cease forever to be able to do it.”

[Anomaly]

Both coaches and participants play an equal factor on a teams success.

Our school started SciOly in 2015. We had 7 members, all of which were Desi girls. 6 sixth graders and one seventh grader. In other words, we were the saddest looking team imaginable. We compete in CE PA (which is pretty competitive according to others, even though there aren't many teams), and our first year there were 14 teams. We placed 12th out of 14, and we participated in 9 events. Of those 9 events, we placed in 4 (one 2nd, one 3rd, and two 4ths). That was my first experience and I felt pretty proud of myself.

The next year, in 2016, there were 9 of us, once again all Desi, but this time we had a boy and more 8th graders. We doubled our participation to 18 events (medaled in 9), and we were 5th out of 15, missing states by 7 points. However, it was during that year that we had some administrative issues. Our SO team is a parent run thing and the school has no involvement in it. The head coach wasn't very good at doing his job (he encouraged cheating), and everyone was accusing him of keeping money for himself, so the adults voted for a new head coach and decided to keep it a sort of democracy. Since then, we've been a lot better off when it comes to that kind of stuff.

This year, in 2017, the old head coach didn't even participate and neither did his child. We achieved a full 15 member team by regionals (a week before regionals), made up of many ethnic groups, and placed in 16 events (and participated in all). This year, we got 2nd in the region, and are moving on to states. No one would have thought that our team jumped from 12th to 5th to 2nd in three years.

Moral of the story? Both play a factor in a team's success, and the main thing is to keep everyone happy as well, because if a person hates the topics he or she is doing, they aren't going to do well on it, and it doesn't hurt to have some team bonding outings either. And because of this, I think our team may be known for being the loudest during any event and being... unique.

[kenniky]

On a completely different note our team is almost completely student driven and we're a top 15 team

It's a lot about culture and motivation especially in Div C

[Skink]

The bottom line here is that there a plethora of factors impacting team success. If your team does a few to a handful of them well, you can excel even if deficient in other areas. If deficient in certain combinations of these, though, you won't do so well. And, naturally, checking enough boxes predisposes you to success.

school size
school location
school grade levels / team age distribution
participant count
participant motivation
participation raw talent
participant dedication
participant experience
coach experience
program rigor
practice frequency
team history
parent / community support
supply / resource bank
program management
adult event oversight
community culture
school culture
team culture
season length
budget
raw number of hours put into program by any combination of participants / coaches / parents / others
number of registered teams in state
competitiveness of teams in region
competitiveness of teams in state
event supervisor competence / adherence to rules
access to invitationals
etc. (not an exhaustive list)

And, there's an exception to every rule, of course. When Green Bunny JHS takes first place in WIDI at the Regional tournament, you know there's more to this than a little dedication here or there. Anyway, if it's unclear what the importance of any of those is, holler.

[Georgetotsi]

Nothing really beats hardwork. Team or individual...it all boils down to who wants it more and who works harder to get it.

[Avogadro]

Admittedly I'll be speaking for Div C here, but I am coming from the perspective of a team who, although not traditionally all too low ranked, is struggling to overcome a ranking barrier. The main difference I've seen between years (like this one) when we are a bit more successful as opposed to others has been three factors: community, time investment, and motivation. The people this year have bonded much more closely, have invested much more time (more meetings for longer), and have been more driven to succeed then I've seen some other years. The community part may not seem important, but it helps to improve one's attitude and keep one driven to succeed not just for oneself but for one's teammates. That being said, there are so many more factors that can impact success (with unfortunate things like our sister school getting I believe almost triple our funding proving that) so it's impossible to isolate just a few.